Why I Hate Ron Paul
There are a lot of people out there calling “Dr. Paul” an idiot, racist, or whatever. I’m not going to engage in the name calling, I prefer to save that for pea-brained troglodytes like that commie socialist gun-grabbing corruptocrat, Hillary, and her unconstitutionally-reelection-seeking hubby, Captain Fellatio Bill.
Nonono, I hate Ron Paul because he comes so close to being an excellent candidate, but he falls short on the most frustratingly obvious point, one that is an absolute deal-breaker for me.
First, a summary of some things I agree with, from Ron Paul on the Issues:
Abolish the IRS? Check.
Stop funding the UN? Check.
Personal Retirement Accounts? Check.
Abolishing the Federal welfare system? Check.
Opposition of “hate crime” legislation? Check.
No affirmative action? Check.
Banning partial-birth abortions? Check.
War on “some drugs” should be turned over to states? Check.
Allow law-abiding to carry concealed? Hell yeah.
To be sure, there’s much more that I agree with. But here’s what I can’t get past:
9/11 resulted from blasphemy of our bases in Saudi Arabia. (Dec 2007)
Suicide terrorism stops when we stop intervening abroad. (Dec 2007)
The sheer dumbassery of those two points removes any and all doubt I would have about not supporting Ron Paul with my vote. That’s why I hate the man. He’s like that ex-girlfriend who was whip-smart, funny, supremely sexy, but insisted on moaning orgasmically as she picked and ate her own boogers as an appetizer any time you went to a crowded restaurant together. I’m sorry, that’s a personal trait I just can’t manage get past.
Blaming “America the Imperialist Neocon Thug” for the fact that there are Islamo-fascist jihadis who would love nothing more than to behead me and mine is not only short-sighted, it’s downright wrong. For centuries these people have been fighting, torturing, oppressing and conquering according to what is laid out quite plainly in the Quran. They’ve been messin’ shit up long before we had bases over there, and they’re going to keep doing it because it’s part of their culture, not AMERICA’S FAULT.
Every individual on this earth has a right - as far as I’m concerned - to believe whatever they want to believe about whatever it is they desire. That right stops abruptly, however, when it threatens one of mine. I am not a religious individual, but I do manage to enjoy having my head attached, and I do believe that every human has some basic rights not to have their privates mutilated, not to be hanged because of their sexual affiliations, and not to be buried up to their necks and stoned because they were raped or sought the affections of someone inappropriately. Look, it’s not me, and it’s not fantasy land I’m living in. When your holy book states quite simply and clearly that you are to spread Islam by the sword, well, that pretty much throws reasoned discourse out the window as an option. Savage religious barbarians aren’t ones for chatting and coming up with amicable solutions to disagreement.
Dr. Paul is taking a short-cut. His stance on “why they hate us” is so unfathomably short-sighted and uneducated that I simply can’t get past it. If that’s his stance on such an obvious issue, what else can’t I trust him on?
So for that, I hate him. It’s potential unrealized. A smart man with good vision otherwise.
Damn that orgasmic booger-munching.
Liberty on December 26th 2007 in Political Blather
Commenter [Visitor] responded on 26 Dec 2007 at 9:05 am #
I encourage you to delve just a little deeper with regard to Paul. For example, Paul recommended Letters of Marque and Reprisal as the appropriate response to 9/11 and questions the efficacy of our actions in Iraq, but that does not mean he would make the US less defensible from a Jihadist threat.
http://www.house.gov/paul/press/press2001/pr101101.htm
http://www.house.gov/paul/congrec/congrec2001/cr092501.htm
http://www.house.gov/paul/congrec/congrec2002/cr091002.htm
Dennis Stonehocker [Visitor] responded on 26 Dec 2007 at 9:12 am #
Well said! I agree totally with you on this issue. Ron Paul is excellent on every issue except for the most important one. The last time I checked, the bombings and killings going on around the world in almost every country has nothing to do with our bases in the middle east.
Mike Helfer [Visitor] responded on 26 Dec 2007 at 9:41 am #
Fighting violence with violence only results in more violence. Jesus taught this. Gandhi taught this. Martin Luther King Jr. taught this. Krishnamurti, Osho, Siddhartha, the Dalai Lama — all the greatest spiritual teachers who have ever lived have taught this.
But you seem to be calling their simple wisdom “dumbassery”? Who are you? You are no one.
By the way, if you don’t recall… Osama Bin Laden himself has communicated to the White House more than once that the #1 reason the Saudi (not Iraqi) extremists attacked us was in 9/11 was because we violated their religion by being on sacred Muslim ground. Our bases are over there. Our soldiers are over there.
We have already tried force and violence — it’s not working. Why not try peace now? Why not try different tactics and see which ones work? I don’t understand the need for inflexibility. What’s that about — profit???
Harrison Bergeron [Visitor] responded on 26 Dec 2007 at 12:45 pm #
You hate Ron Paul because he speaks the truth about why AQ has attacked us? THAT would be some true dumbassery, right there. The truth is that they are attacking us because they don’t like our foreign policies in the ME and the wider Islamic world. I strongly suggest you read Michael Scheuer’s excellent works on the topic. They aren’t attacking us because we’re free, they are attacking us because of our policies in the ME. Whether you like it or not, that is the reality. This reality may not be PC enough for you, but that does not change the fact that it is the reality.
Also, you might want to try actually reading the Koran before you make comments on what it instructs its followers to do. Spreading Islam by the sword is not only not instructed in the Koran, it is specifically prohibited. The Koran states, quite clearly without room for dispute that “there is no compulsion in religion”, and it prohibits Muslims from waging wars of aggression. Again, this is reality.
Furthermore, there seems to be a tendency amongst the fools who spew the “they attack us because we’re free” nonsense to conflate ALL violence by all Muslims as being part of some unified movement wherein all groups and individuals share the same goal. This is dangerously stupid, as there are many different Islamic militant groups fighting for many different reasons around the world. Lumping them all in together as though they were all part of the same thing is just plain stupid.
Liberty [Member] responded on 26 Dec 2007 at 1:48 pm #
Paulians coming out of the woodwork! Now I know how to get people to visit this blog!
Okay, just a couple of points here. First, there is a place for force and violence. If our founding fathers adopted non-violence as a solution, we’d all be breaking for tea time. Ignoring that is ignoring the harsh reality that there are people out there who DO want to harm us if we do not believe as they do. Not to mention the fact that a few of those great spiritual leaders you mentioned were, well … assassinated. Lotta good peace and happiness did them.
Second, Mike, you’re telling me that violence on the part of AQ is justified because of our blasphemy, but WE need to lay down our arms and practice peace? Why the double standard? Violence is a-ok if we’re doing something to provoke it, but otherwise everybody just needs a hug? No thanks.
Harrison. Onward, dhimmi soldier. I’d refer to someone who studies the Quran more than I do such as Robert Spencer: http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/archives/003359.php
That tells you all you need to know about your compulsion defense.
I don’t hate Ron Paul because he speaks the truth. I hate Ron Paul because he’s wrong, you idiot. Being PC has nothing to do with it. The fact that the Quran is quite crystal clear (and has been … for centuries) in the subjugation of women, the domination of Islam, and the oppression of ANYONE (not Americans, not “Free people” - ANYONE) who does not believe in Islam as the one true faith pretty much says it all.
Hey, if you don’t mind paying jizya to your barbarian masters, that’s up to you. As for the dumbassery - I find the idea that everybody will love us if we leave them alone to be pure dumbassery. People willing to blow themselves up in crowded restaurants don’t listen to reason and they’re not going to all of a sudden say, “Hey! They left our land! Thank goodness we don’t have to indoctrinate our children into the ways of martyrdom anymore!”
Mind you, I never said, “they attack us because we’re free!” Being free has nothing to do with it. Not being under Sharia does. You’re completely ignoring the fact that savages across the Middle East are raising their children to march in parades dressed as suicide bombers. There’s video of a 12-year-old beheading a kidnapped man, even. Is that the fault of our military bases, too? Moors! Ottomans! Abu Bakr set Islam on a course of nearly 1500 years of warfare and conquest all because we’re occupiers!
Bull. Shit.
But thanks for visiting!
Dennis Stonehocker [Visitor] responded on 26 Dec 2007 at 4:16 pm #
The last time I checked the only way to fight violence was with violence. If you want to quote Jesus you need to keep in mind that Jesus was also the same God that used a lot of violence in the Old Testament. (I’m asuming since you mentioned Jesus as a role model that you suscribe to the fact that Jesus is God) Remember, those that beat their swords into plowshares will plow for those who don’t!
Dennis
Patrick Henry [Visitor] responded on 26 Dec 2007 at 5:27 pm #
Study the history of American foreign policy and you’ll see why Ron Paul is right on this. Our rulers are as savage as any group of people despite the advancement of the technology under their control.
“They’ve been messin’ shit up long before we had bases over there, and they’re going to keep doing it because it’s part of their culture, not AMERICA’S FAULT.”
True, but the question is whether they are going to mess up our shit or their shit. History shows quite clearly that if you mess with other people’s shit then they will do the same with yours. We messed with the nations of the Middle East long before the nations of the Middle East messed with America. The actions of Americans don’t excuse the immoral actions of any Middle Eastern individual, nor does theirs excuse ours.
Patrick Henry [Visitor] responded on 26 Dec 2007 at 6:00 pm #
“Hey, if you don’t mind paying jizya to your barbarian masters, that’s up to you.”
Actually, most of America’s barbarian masters claim to be Christian. Very few Muslims in the top tiers of the federal government. It is a growing number but it appears the Christians forming cell networks (see Harper’s article “Jesus Plus Nothing”) are a far more serious threat to America as far as religious fanatics go. There is also the tremendous amount of fraud and many other crimes in the televangelism and mega church and other cults such as Scientology.
Dennis Stonehocker [Visitor] responded on 26 Dec 2007 at 6:07 pm #
True, but the question is whether they are going to mess up our shit or their shit. History shows quite clearly that if you mess with other people’s shit then they will do the same with yours. We messed with the nations of the Middle East long before the nations of the Middle East messed with America. The actions of Americans don’t excuse the immoral actions of any Middle Eastern individual, nor does theirs excuse ours.
Thats exactly why we have developed a strong military over the last century. They have something that we need. We are willing to play nice and make them rich or if they want to act like 7th century morons then we need to put some of those expensive weapons systems to work.
This is the real world. We’ve paid a lot for the best military in the world and if that translates into lower gas prices at the pumps, Great!
Dennis
Liberty [Member] responded on 26 Dec 2007 at 6:27 pm #
Patrick, come on. “Study the history of American foreign policy and you’ll see why Ron Paul is right on this. Our rulers are as savage as any group of people despite the advancement of the technology under their control.”
Have you lost your mind? Since when do we hang homosexuals by cranes in public squares and bury women up to their necks to throw stones and crush their skulls? Honor killing isn’t part of our domestic policy.
And beyond that … compare major technological innovations that come from our free market compared to some bass ackwards sharia-run government.
“most of America’s barbarian masters claim to be Christian”
You are comparing fraud - a reprehensible, but non-violent crime - with Islamic barbarism?
I’m about 0% religious, but that’s just plain stupid. Fraud does not equal barbarism. Grouping those barbarians who would kill (John Allen Muhammad, Fort Dix Six, Ali al-Timimi and the Virginia Jihad Network, Buffalo Six, Dhiren Barot, etc. - on US soil) and televangelists who may be criminals and thieves but not mass-murderers is about as retarded a conclusion as anyone could muster. Terrorism exist in many forms, but come on, that’s an idiotic comparison.
Do you truly believe you would be better off in Saudi Arabia (where there are portions of HIGHWAY that are “Muslim Only”) than you would in the United States?
You only need to compare human rights records between America and ANY country run by an Islamic government to come to the very obvious conclusion that even with all of our faults and a bloated government, we are further along and much better off. Unless you don’t mind things like beheadings, public hangings, stoning, being arrested for wearing “western style clothes”, and so on.
Harrison Bergeron [Visitor] responded on 26 Dec 2007 at 6:44 pm #
See, I’ve known far too many Muslims in my lifetime to take seriously the ravings of a demented bigot like Mr. Spencer. Also, I know how to read, and therefore can definitively state that the Koran prohibits both forced conversions and wars of aggression. This does not mean, of course, that people who call themselves Muslims have not done both of those thing over the course of history. I would no more let Robert Spencer lecture me on Muslims than I would let David Duke lecture me on Jews or black people.
Now, as to why AQ is attacking us, the record is equally crystal clear. It is not because we do not live under Sharia. It is because of our policies in the ME. You are making the typical mistake of leftists and right-wingers, that is collectivist thinking. The Ottoman Empire(which was FAR more religiously tolerant than the Christian nations of its time) is not al Qaeda. There are many, many different sects, ethnicities, and nationalities of Islam, many different groups and organizations with many different goals and grievances, some legitimate some not. AQ is one group with one set of goals, Hamas is a different group with a different set of goals, Hezbollah is another, the Kashmiri militants another, and so on and so forth. The collectivist sees all of those people as being the same thing. They are not.
Al Qaeda does not recruit people by talking of spreading Sharia around the world, they talk about Western aggression against Muslims. They talk about the creation of Israel, US soldiers in Saudi Arabia, Gulf war, sanctions against Iraq, and so on and so forth. That is how they attempt to appeal to Muslims, to get them to join them. That is what they teach them at their training camps, formerly in Afghanistan now in western Pakistan. That is what bin Laden has consistently said in his public statements, both to the West and the Islamic world. That is what Khalid Sheikh Mohammed said in his confession.
Dennis Stonehocker [Visitor] responded on 26 Dec 2007 at 7:03 pm #
Al Qaeda does not recruit people by talking of spreading Sharia around the world, they talk about Western aggression against Muslims. They talk about the creation of Israel, US soldiers in Saudi Arabia, Gulf war, sanctions against Iraq, and so on and so forth. That is how they attempt to appeal to Muslims, to get them to join them. That is what they teach them at their training camps, formerly in Afghanistan now in western Pakistan. That is what bin Laden has consistently said in his public statements, both to the West and the Islamic world. That is what Khalid Sheikh Mohammed said in his confession.
And?…so you’ve described the thugs that make up current Islam. You really want to take the chance that they love you and have your best intrests at heart? These people are cold-blooded killers that will kill you and your family and then praise allah. Son, you need to wake up before it’s too late.
Dennis
Harrison Bergeron [Visitor] responded on 26 Dec 2007 at 7:08 pm #
And?…so you’ve described the thugs that make up current Islam. You really want to take the chance that they love you and have your best intrests at heart? These people are cold-blooded killers that will kill you and your family and then praise allah. Son, you need to wake up before it’s too late
Well, who the hell said anything about that? Who said there aren’t people trying to kill Americans? Does not my statements about why AQ attacks us presuppose that AQ attacks us, and is dangerous? Who said anything about them having our best interests at heart, besides yourself?
Dennis Stonehocker [Visitor] responded on 26 Dec 2007 at 7:13 pm #
See, I’ve known far too many Muslims in my lifetime to take seriously the ravings of a demented bigot like Mr. Spencer. Also, I know how to read, and therefore can definitively state that the Koran prohibits both forced conversions and wars of aggression. This does not mean, of course, that people who call themselves Muslims have not done both of those thing over the course of history. I would no more let Robert Spencer lecture me on Muslims than I would let David Duke lecture me on Jews or black people.
Now, as to why AQ is attacking us, the record is equally crystal clear. It is not because we do not live under Sharia. It is because of our policies in the ME. You are making the typical mistake of leftists and right-wingers, that is collectivist thinking. The Ottoman Empire(which was FAR more religiously tolerant than the Christian nations of its time) is not al Qaeda. There are many, many different sects, ethnicities, and nationalities of Islam, many different groups and organizations with many different goals and grievances, some legitimate some not. AQ is one group with one set of goals, Hamas is a different group with a different set of goals, Hezbollah is another, the Kashmiri militants another, and so on and so forth. The collectivist sees all of those people as being the same thing. They are not.
You did.
Dennis
Liberty [Member] responded on 26 Dec 2007 at 7:19 pm #
“Al Qaeda does not recruit people by talking of spreading Sharia around the world”
Agreed. That’s left to the Imams. Not the same as AQ. No need to focus on AQ when there’s plenty to go around. And I’m very happy for you that you’ve known many Mid-East Muslims educated in madrassas and indoctrinated by imams to come to your astute conclusions about Mr. Spencer (and I’m guessing Daniel Pipes didn’t get a Christmas card from you either?).
“They talk about the creation of Israel, US soldiers in Saudi Arabia, Gulf war, sanctions against Iraq, and so on and so forth. That is how they attempt to appeal to Muslims, to get them to join them. That is what they teach them at their training camps…”
And it’s what they’ll continue to say long after we’re gone and not because “we were there.” Groups that kill other people because of cartoons do not deserve the benefit of the doubt. Societies that preach hate and back it up with some of the most despicable acts of domestic horror you’ve ever seen do not deserve the benefit of the doubt as Dr. Paul (or at least his supporters) are so quick to bestow.
Assume a massive pullout. Are they all going to sing, dance, shoot guns in the air and then turn to each other and say, “Well that was wild. What next? Wanna catch a movie?” Or are they going to start killing each other and seeing who can out-Islamic each other and still hate us all anyway? And still plot terrorism in their “war against the West?”
Right or wrong, pulling out and ignoring savages is akin to burying your head in the sand and hoping the bad people go away. Dr. Paul believes they will. I believe they won’t. There goes my vote.
I am not making a “typical mistake of collectivist thinking” by recognizing that Hamas, Hezbollah, AQ, militant A, B, and C all seem to have something in common, I’m stating the obvious which you so conveniently circumvent with some of that John Kerry-esque “Nuance”. It’s certainly not black and white. Certainly not every group is identical, but there does happen to be a lot in common and … keeping this on topic … Ron Paul’s collectivist solution of, “Leave them all alone” is a pretty broad paint-brush that would not gain us the same courtesy in return.
As far as forced conversions, that’s a well-documented bit of history and it’s been going on for a long time regardless of what you believe the Quran states. And saying, “Christians were evil killers too” does not diminish the fact that Islamic violence, war, life and death by the sword is rooted so deeply in that culture that it will never leave no matter how nice we are, how many concessions we give, or how much we submit.
Harrison Bergeron [Visitor] responded on 26 Dec 2007 at 7:20 pm #
You… You’re kidding, right? There is nothing in my post that says AQ isn’t attacking us, or that they have our best interests at heart, or that they love us. Are you familiar with the concept of the strawman? Because your interpretation of my position bears no resemblance to my actual position.
Harrison Bergeron [Visitor] responded on 26 Dec 2007 at 7:23 pm #
Liberty, you do realize that Paul voted to authorize the use of military force in Afghanistan, right? And that he suggests, as the first respondent noted, that Congress should issue letters of marque and reprisal against AQ and the Taliban, that he supports the use of military force against people who attack us but NOT the global military empire we’ve been pursuing since at least the end of WW2?
Commenter [Visitor] responded on 26 Dec 2007 at 8:48 pm #
Two weeks ago, Antiwar.com received a letter from a non-commissioned officer in the U.S. Marine Corps wondering what motivated our behavior. One of my jobs for Antiwar.com is handling letters like these, and since he asked like a gentleman, I’ve done my best to represent the site and the case against the war.
What follows, with his permission and with his name and rank omitted, is our discussion:Date: Sun, 16 Dec 2007 21:05:06 -0800 To: @antiwar.com Subject: Inquiry from website—-(USMC) submitted a link…here are the results! Subject: motive…
http://www.antiwar.com/blog/2007/12/26/arguing-the-war/
Nappy [Visitor] responded on 27 Dec 2007 at 2:36 pm #
Maybe you should understand how influential The Zionist jews are, and what their global objective is, before you bash RP.
Liberty [Member] responded on 27 Dec 2007 at 4:22 pm #
I’m not bashing, I just think he’s a complete fucking kook, that’s all. I didn’t call him an evil little Leprechaun-looking fellow with runny shit for brains who wouldn’t recognize an intelligent foreign policy decision if it ran up to him and slapped him on the cojones. THAT would be bashing.
So enlighten me, Nappy from Colorado Springs! How influential are those Zionist jews and what is their global objective?